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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
 Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 08:57:04 AM
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| John, It sounds as though you are doing a good job of this. I'd be disappointed if the rules didn't accomodate the poms and yanks bikes, even if they simply allow for 'exceptions'. I suggest we should always look at the potential in involving international competitors. If this thing gets going, the way I suspect, I believe it will be magnificent. We could even get RIDERS of 'modern' superbikes involved in their 'off season'! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 10:56:47 AM
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Alan, if we are planning to represent the pre 1980 Superbikes there were no overseas machines generally around, the series had its first Championship in Victoria in 1979.
Personally I dont give a bugger about trying to attract overseas machines to this event at this stage, if they match the old style they can come anyway but I dont believe anything should be distorted by way of excemptions to attract them. That would destroy the concept right from the start.
An integral part of thsi plan has always been to try and be a pure as possible, otherwise it just becomes a "me too" event. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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Gosling1
Level 2 Member
Australian Capital Territory
52 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 6:57:15 PM
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John - how many rider profiles do you already have ? I can dig out some info on selected riders if you let me know who you would like a profile on.
cheers
Dave |
".....we're gonna get it this time......he had his indicator on....." |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 7:49:16 PM
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| PM< sent dave |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 09:43:10 AM
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John, I ran some of my previous comments psst a friend. He pointed out 'you can't have it both ways'. I suggested previously that we should look at the 1981 GCRs, also we should try to accomodate 'trick frames'. The two comments are contradictory. THe original class w hich was so successful was 'improved touring' and the trick stuff would never have been permitted. On thinking about it, the old r ules probably stopped the big money guys from having too much advantage, and were probably fairer than anything we can come up with now.
I apologise for getting a bit confused about the differences between period 5 machines and historic superbikes. Obviously historic superbikes would get a ride in period 5 races, the reverse isn't necessarily true.
I now agree with your stance on what the class should represent. keep up the good work.
best regards,
Alan Cotterell |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 10:16:54 AM
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Thanks for coming around to the realisation of what I was trying to achieve.
I believe the aspect of staying true to form will make the series facinating.
As I have said somewhere, if we only get 6 machines I will be content because it may grow from there. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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OldKwak
Level 2 Member
Victoria
156 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 4:59:50 PM
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| Great, Lets get the rules going!!! |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 8:07:54 PM
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I suggest that there would be more than six bikes which would meet the '81 GCRs in P4 and P5 at every historic meeting held these days! The way you suggest it s hould be run, the owners of the superbikes will 'hit the wall', as far as development is concerned. It means the fastest guy is actually the fastest guy, not the one with the biggest bankroll. I can see availability of 18 inch race tyres becoming a problem. As I've said I support the idea of running historic superbikes the way it was done in Australia, between 1977 and 1983, until the international community changed the rules and stuffed the game! I believe that whatever we did back then in superbikes, it was a formula for success! As I've said before, Mick Ronke mentioned that the biggest ever motorcycle meeting at Winton was in about 1982, and all the 'name riders' were there! I know he'd like that to happen again!
Incidentally, I believe the noise rules were in force back then, and that affected performance . I seem to remember my friends got their backsides kicked at Bathurst for allowing a baffle to fall out of the exhaust. It was the only way to get the bike really going! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 8:54:40 PM
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Rules are in the grinder and subject to a read over by the wisw ones I shall publish when thats completed, probally within 7 days.
Dont worry Alan, there will not be many bikes fitting the criteria of looking like a fair dinkum HSB, but it would take much to rectify if people choose to do so. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2007 : 08:12:14 AM
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| I've never really looked at comparing the current Period 5 bikes in the light of being late seventies superbikes. Because of the time that's gone past it's difficult to remember exactly what they looked like. I seem to remember that the Z1R we ran at Bathurst looked pretty standard. I believe it had a fork brace, a pipe, and a braced swing arm. I don't think Guest's or Korp's Kawasakis would look much different to what was run back then |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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fastsuzuki
Level 2 Member
Victoria
20 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2007 : 10:43:20 AM
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| My feeling is that P5 has gone past the original intent of the class, with frames, engines and other components that were never seen or simply not around at the time. I think that there are a number of machines that do or can comply with minimal modifications eg remove the seat/tailpiece units. It has become a class where you have to spend a lot to turn an old bike into a much modified shadow of its former self with cartridge forks, slipper clutches, modified rake and trail and billet blocks to name a few mods floating around. I think the adage "if you are not winning, your'e not cheating enough' could be applied at the moment. Might be a slight bitch here |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 12 Aug 2007 : 6:25:09 PM
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| Talking about 'cartridge front forks', I heard a young guy at a race meeting recently, ask his dad in a loud voice ' Are these the forks with the RS125 Honda bits in them?'. His old man has a Period 3 Manx Norton!! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 13 Aug 2007 : 11:01:27 PM
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aL, PLEASE STICK TO THE TOPIC.
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John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 14 Aug 2007 : 11:49:07 PM
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| THe comment 'if you aren't winning, you're not cheating enough' could be said of any historic bike class devised so far! The big thing about historic racing is that you can have fun through developing your bike. However an unwelcome consequence is that any spectator on a nostalgia kick would be looking in the wrong place, if they looked at 'normal' historic bike races! I suggest the beauty of John's formula for historic superbikes will be that the class will have a level of AUTHENTICITY we haven't seen before. That should be it's major attraction for spectators! In the late 70s/early 80s, the class was extremely successful. I believe it will be again if the resurrection is done well. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 07:36:32 AM
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| Did we finally end up with the dedicated web site for historic superbikes? |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 07:40:46 AM
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| Previously I commented that we should try to accomodate the Poms and Yanks bikes in this class. I now agree with John on this also - 'historic superbikes' was and is our game, and they should play it our way! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 08:53:26 AM
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Yes.quote:
Originally posted by acotrel
Did we finally end up with the dedicated web site for historic superbikes?
Just waiting for more information to add to the site for John Daley even though it is up and running. |
Regards,
David
Webmaster & Owner of Classic Motorcycling Australia
Quote: I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted to be paid. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2007 : 09:04:40 AM
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| I in turn are still waiting for the completion of the Rider profiles, which another reader has offered to help with. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 23 Aug 2007 : 2:21:30 PM
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| It looks like we're not the only people interested in the history of superbike racing! Have you guys seen the write-ups in this months Classic Racer? They cover stuff that is a bit more 'modern' than 1983, however it's still interesting! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
Posted - 23 Aug 2007 : 3:36:45 PM
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| So there you have it Alan, all under control from both John and myself. |
Regards,
David
Webmaster & Owner of Classic Motorcycling Australia
Quote: I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted to be paid. |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 23 Aug 2007 : 7:32:27 PM
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| Lovely stuff, David! I'm getting a bit excited about the likelihood of seeing this class get going! |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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Gosling1
Level 2 Member
Australian Capital Territory
52 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2007 : 8:07:48 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by john
I in turn are still waiting for the completion of the Rider profiles, which another reader has offered to help with.
I have sent you an e-mail with some juicy attachments John - Basically, its the complete set of rider profiles from the Race Programme for the 1979 Castrol 6-Hour. It includes short profiles on such legends as :
Roger Heyes
Mike Cole
Rob Phillis
Andrew Johnson
Graeme Crosby
Tony Hatton
John Pace
Alan Hales
Neil Chivas
Alan Decker
Graeme Muir
Gregg Hansford
Dave Hiscock
Neville Hiscock
Len Atlee
Gary Coleman
Wes Cooley
Helmut Dahne
Kenny Blake
Johnny Warrian
Ron Boulden
Rod Cox
Len Willing
Alan Blanco
Emmanual Blanco
Chris Oldfield
Rob Scolyer
Rob Moorhouse
Jim Judd
Martin Hone
There are a number of other great Aussie racers of this period who did not enter the 1979 6-Hour of course (eg Murray Sayle, Warren Willing, Jeff Sayle, Peter Campbell, Vaughan Coburn, Greg Johnson, Graeme McGregor, Barry Smith, Rick Walden) - a number of these competitors had been competing in Europe during 1979....and this is by no means a comprehensive list......but it will sure give you something to work with.
cheers
Dave
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".....we're gonna get it this time......he had his indicator on....." |
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David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2007 : 09:09:32 AM
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Thanks David.
Gosling has helped with some details of rider prophiles and history I shall send it over in a day or so. It is in the form of photos of magazines so I am not sure how to present it. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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Rosko
Level 1 Member
New South Wales
13 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2007 : 9:40:45 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by john
I am sure we can make provision for short term chnages to suit overseas teams if this idea ever gets big enough.
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Rosko
Level 1 Member
New South Wales
13 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2007 : 9:46:42 PM
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Hello Guys.
I just joined the forum.
If you need Superbike info or pics just ask.
Ross Hannan
Ex Racer and Sponsor
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2007 : 9:56:16 PM
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| Yes please, more info etc. I will get the data Gosling found so far set up. The aim is to have the web site explain why we are promoting the history of superbike racing. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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Rosko
Level 1 Member
New South Wales
13 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2007 : 10:09:34 PM
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The list forgot Gary Thomas he won the very first Superbike race in Australia at Amaroo Park on a HI Kawasaki, forgot the year but i think it was early 70s.
Rosko
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2007 : 10:36:11 PM
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| I need the date of the first race confirmed. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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Rosko
Level 1 Member
New South Wales
13 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2007 : 10:52:48 PM
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It was early 70’s at Amaroo Park called Chesterfield series Run by Willoughby Club (Vince Tesseriro). It was actually the first named Superbike race in the world; this at the time didn’t exist in Europe or US. I sponsored Ron Toombs on a modified Honda K1750 I built. I will find out the exact date and let you know.
Rosko
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